Holy mother of all necros! Like literally Herbert West kind of stuff. :)

Jokes asides, being hidden behind a monitor and keyboard "helps" people to behave like a-holes, there's nothing a company can do to be sure to avoid what people nowadays calls "toxiciy".

Competitive/PvP focused games are of course affected even more, but wasn't very different in the age of MUDs and so on, just way less people playing online on a single game so less chances to notice it.

Well British Huricans should have disbanded then shouldn't they?

I mean they were relegated together with WHO.

But then you watch a different environment and you realize a team made of those players (BH) managed to embarass a team made by OWL ones (whatever the reasons were, US was destroyed by UK).

Should Muma, Sinatra and all the other guys look for a different job?

Of course not, the issue is that players need to have contracts, as every other friggin profession.

Otherwise this time is Midna, the next Chubz, then someone else, 'cause orgs will keep burning them like junk while hoping to draw a lucky card out of the bunch (aka a future "star" player) which they will lose right away to OWL and Academy teams, since... well they do offer contracts.

There are 2 issues here imo.

The one you cite, not having enough money in the system (T2-T3 scene of OW), and so no contracts for the players, which leads to orgs trating them like disposable junk.

And the other one, more specific for Midna, the guy is of course no OWL material, but has played vs OWL players and on an international stage (World Cup) performing very well (2 of the Italians players performed really well, one was him).

On top of that has already proved he can play at Contenders level, WHO wasn't the bottom of last Contenders, ended S2 of contenders with a slightly better result of the team Chubz was playing in (Copenhagen Flames).

Now taken all this into consideration, I understand dorpping him once, you (the manager) decided Chubz has better potential, but not dropin twice in the space of 1 month, after he's brought you again to Contenders.

But then it's just us speaking, what's almost sure, Midna has basically quit playing OW profesionally (he's almost 20 I guess so not so old) after this, and it's a shame to see a talented player quit the game like that.

Well what can we tell you?
https://youtu.be/ojydNb3Lrrs

Not just the color also the shape of the logo screams runaway btw.

Sick match, with some server drama included!
GG both, Kensi's Mei si always amazing as well as Leaf's Doomfist.

When people will realize that depression (the actual one, not the one most people believe to have) is a bad spot to be in?

I don't particulary like or dislike the guy, and not even trying to analyze him or something, it might just be he's an a-hole, but it looks like a case of actual depression, which has nothing to do with OW or streaming (even if being exposed to loads of people doesn't help).

What pisses me off is the random guys telling him "c'mon bru don't give up, it's going to be great" or on the other side of the spectrum the ones going for "Eh wouldn't expect otherwise from such a troll/whatever".

That's not what you want to hear, ever, and not what you need to hear either, but I get it, nobody forced him to play OW or stream, so it's ultimately "on him".

If he goes on streaming and into OWL, or decides to follow a different path, I hope he finds some balance.

https://youtu.be/Hgd2F2QNfEE

Nice video and good (not great) logo, but agree sick skins, but I tend to love all shades of blue. :)

I'm not mad at Chubz, not his fault at all, a player does what he has to do in the T2 scene.

I'm looking at WHO's management, this is not how you treat your players, and they should know better, considering one of them has been both a player and a manager in the team.

I'm not really mad either, just a bit pissed, now imagine this happening on your daily working life:

• Boss: "Roazhon, you have to deliver, we have to get into this deal"
  You and you colleagues deliver and get into this deal
• Boss: "Nice job guys, now you are fired as I'm hiring some shinier dudes to do your job"
  These new dudes don't show up (whatever the reason)
• Boss: "Damn Roazhon, please come back to work for me, same stiuplations, we gotta get that deal!"
  You do it again
• Boss: "sucks being you, one of the other guys just called me back, you are out, thanks for all the fish!"

Mind you I could even expect it from a multinational company (in OW standards let's say an OWL team), but from a family ran one? WHO are team put together by players and managed (in part) again from the players (TwolzZ specifically).

Oof the downvotes on that. :)

Like I said, I get it, and I wasn't even asking for an EN vido INSTEAD of the FR one, but for both versions instead of the subs.

It doesn't take much to dub a 42 secs long video, and (imo) passes the message you are first and foremost a FR team but also the only team in EU actually caring for the EU community (as representation I mean).

Oh well I guess it's just me.

I like the logo, full of meaning (despite some people making fun of it, it is full of meaning), and I get it this is Paris' team, so to an extent a French team, but damn they could have at least made 2 videos the one in FR and one in English?

I know in the end it's business, but damn treating Midna (a good tank that brought them twice to Contenders) like a POS,
Almost wish Chubz will leave them again.

E vai ragazzi!!
Ok not a huge a fan of buying slots, but eh we got in. :)
The roster is stacked, GL for the matches!

But Soe has nothing to share with Reinforce's role on the desk thou.

That's pretty much the point, he was the only one on the desk with professional expereince as a player, and I'm not one of the guys telling that you need to be GM to be allowed to cast or to analyze a match, but that doesn't remove the utility of someone who has actual experiences in a team environment and on being "behind a keyboard" when it actually matters.

That's not likely to happen, not for this season at least, since Jake declared he was going back to play right at the end of his last brodcast in the WWC matches.

More likely someone like Seagull?

Whoever they are replacing him with is damn sad, the guy keeps getting the shrot stick. :(

This desk thou! :)

What a match, gg Korea, but...
DAMN GREAT JOB UK!

Just to put it there, a team full of top Korean OWL S1 veterans, vs a team based around 1 OWL player and bunch of EU Contenders Trials players.

Let's go UK!!

Bren's killing it. :D

Hehe likely, but honestly I don't see many putting up a real fight vs Kore, so eh.

Oof that was rough, and damn Fusions amazing Rei plays on that last map.

I honestly don't know what made everyone so sure this was going to be an easy match for USA.

Were they favourite? Of course yes, but they are not Korea.

I really think this is the closest match of the Quarter Finals, I stand on the opposite side (compared to you) but same feelings.

I strongly wish for FR to win, but have the gut feeling Canada will move forward, with a 3-2 probably.

(then I remember ALL my predictions fail miserably so this is going to be the most onesided match of them all, for who? No idea :D )

Better than not having the torunament, yes absolutely.

Still is sad the only way to see these teams play outside of the official leagues is "for free".

I'm not not blaming the org, which at least managed to put somehting together, I'm blaming the system, for reference:
https://liquipedia.net/dota2/Minor_Tournaments

Absolutely, the idea they have Xepher on their main OWL roster and Manneted on their accademy team still amazes me, but I guess r2der really couldn't stand the idea of coaching western players.

I do wonder though, which team(s) with full or almost full Korean roster will drop into midtier or even worse?

Same thing I was pondering myself, the moment 70-80% of the league becomes Korean the chances of the worst team being a Korean heavy roster increase.

"best case scenario" to mantain the rule of "Koreans are better" should be if Paris is going to be S2 Florida, but what if that's not going to happen?

How much have the teams paid for some of the non ultra-top Korean players?

And one last polemic question I had, what if one of the bottom 2 teams at the end of the season is going to be Florida?

Good to have a nice tournament, and to also have an NA team in it.

But damn, 500 Euros? If the money goes to the players we are speaking of about 60 euros/each, gross for the winning team. :(

True but also means 1/2 the chances for the player to actually play, that's not counting possible "Crazy" meta changes.

While on the other hand if by any chance your main tank gets an injury (or some heavy flue) you'll be forced to use who? One of your 4 DPS players as backup?

That's of course unless (very likely I agree) they add other people to the roster.

Btw, form our lord of the candles:
https://twitter.com/Meza_OW/status/1056988219588444162

Not saying it's a wrong business decision, on the contrary it's the best one, people organizing this kind of "stuff" are not scrubs like me, they really know what they are doing.

And that's the guiding principle for all decisions regarding OW, again nothing wrong in it as long as people understands that's not done to make the scene/league better, not for the players and not for the viewers.

EDIT: btw that's also the main reason why it's mainly NA traditional leagues that have no promotions/relegations.

Honestly wasn't expecting anything different, this direction is in line with what they started in 2017, prior to OWL S1.

The main reason? Investors, plain and simple.

No relegation or promotion in OWL, why? Many reasons imo the main one is, if one of your clients paid you all those mills for a spot, he'd really hate ending up in the T2 scene (e.g. Shangai, Florida) with no visibility at all.

Very strict and relatively limiting rules to follow if you want to organize an OW torunament (limited sponsors, limited prizepools, etc...), Why? Anything big enough could remove visibility and willingness to get into a new season of OWL.

Academy teams automatically invited to each years's 1st Contenders season, why? They are owned by the same guys of the 2 points above, visibility, do you think the owners of Hurricanes and Spitfire were happy that their team could even risk falling out of Contenders?

Is it ever going to change? Not really, not until OWL stops enlarging with the addition of new spots/franchises, or unless for some weird unexpected reason the OW scene will suddenly die.

But are they gonna keep all of them? :(

In before:
Don't give up, we can still win this!

GET OFF MAH YAWN! you mean right?

Far from me to diasgree with you on this, tbh as long as Toronto fans are happy, better for you.

Mine was just an outsider pov on how they marketed the brand, fearing this would happen while wishing more canadian players could be playing in a Candian team.

But again, if you pay loads of money, you do it hoping to win, and if this the best way to win, it's the logical solution.

Damn sorry man, the T2 scene is a mess for you guys... really wish it could be a bit more stable. :(

Btw just to be clear, when I said "I was listening to the conf call" I meant that there's a video on youtube with it, I wasn't in any form involved in it. :)

And nope won't share the link either 'cause (it's pretty easy to find tbh), even if not with Blizzard, I do work in the videogame industry and well... things.

To be fair, I was listening to the conf call (as if the ones I do for a living weren't enough rofl), it isn't reallty that bad, meaning that, already as it is, the T2 scene isn't in a good place.

Yes they'll focus and take care basically only of their OWL franchises, but could we expect otherwise? Consideirng how much money those investros put into it?

Basically what they say in the conf call is:

• Only 2 seasons of Contenders in a year, but both should be a bit longer.
• The first one, only academy teams get into it, everyone else has to go through Trials (yes even possible winners of the previous season), this is true for every first season of a year, this in their word to "Guarantee a standard of quality in the teams that get into contenders.
• The second one, will sort of work like it did so far.
• Someone (Spanish GM/Owner/whatever) asks if Blizzard is going to allow bigger non OWL/Contenders events to happen, the answer is "we never prohibited them" which is true but also a "lie", nothing's gonna change in that regard, if you are willing to organize a tournament under Blizzards stipulations (which aren't changing, or at least not the argument of discussion during this con call).

What the... not even commenting on this tbh. :(

But is it true for all regions? If so how will they force the Korean scene to give up what they had since the get go, a stellar organization and the whole thing on stage?

So yes trying the full Korean roster, which is a shame considering in their reveal video they went full mode on "Canadian pride". :(

So damn happy for Kodak and Masaa.
POG roster

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbGv759-FTk&feature=youtu.be

Language will always be an issue, one thing is to learn the language to play OW, another to learn it to communicate with media and fans.

Besides the standard issues of learning a difficult language (if you are from Korea learning English is harder than let's say for an Italian) there's also the other aspect, which will be present in full Korean rosters, "isolazionism", which always tend to happen when there's no external reason to force you to integrate with a different culture.

I mean it's already happening, in the mixed teams, check Fissure for one outcome or what happened to Florida.

It's easier to surround themselves by people of your own cutlure than use a lot of energies to actually integrate with different cultures, even more so if the vast majority of your energies go into becoming a professional player.

Man I'd really like to have you on board.

The team is based in my city, want me to go there and knock some sense in their heads? :)

There's someone, right below your post that could fit it.
Bring GizmomcS to Italy!!

These are two different aspects thou.
I agree with Wombat, this video isn't good, UNLESS they add local talent (and by local I mean Canadian), but the name? The name is not a bad name for a new team, not at all.

https://news.unikrn.com/article/general-manager-toronto-defiant-overwatch-league-blizzard?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=feature&utm_campaign=gmtorontodefiant102518&utm_term=overwatch&utm_content=ds

Adds some more info for this franchise, the way I see it they are going full Korean (not too happy about it but eh who could blame them?), and if that's the way, this is a huge start, both very solid picks.

Ugh, still peculiar to see mainly the Koreans complain about this mess.

Never been a fan of Huk, has that prima donna attitude that a manager of a team should never have (let the good players have it, if anyone really has to), but I still believe the truth, as often, might lie in between the 2 versions, which is imo even worse as there's no "simple" way to prevent it to happen again.

If it's just the players (Koreans mainly), either go full go Korean or release them (and yes you'll become weaker), if it's just HuK, well force him to take not one but 2 steps back, but if both sides were at it... eh kind of hard to fix it. :(

Just the other day was wondering where Mowzassa was going to play, and here he is!

Damn nice roster! Let's go guys!

But what's defeatist in the word defiant?

I'd say it's actually the contrary, and mind you I might be mistaken give ENG is not my language, but isn't like branding themselves as someone who never gives up?